trinityamps.com

There was a thread recently at the 18watt site - "I'm tired of guys with BBQ kits coming here for help". That poster really got hammered by most of the rest of the board. Who started that thread? I forget.

The same offender in this case.

Just to keep this all on the Up & Up & in the spirit of this forum, I have censored a certain name - it should be obvious. If I see a certain other name show, I will do the same. I don't want a Google search to bring any hassles!

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Stephen
Web: www.trinityamps.com. Facebook: facebook.com/trinityamps. Twitter: @trinityamps

et tu coco?

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--s2
www.s2amps.com
www.category5amps.com

OK - The penny dropped - Now I get the various "BBQ" references
http://www.BBQ.com/bbq/ (for other slow people)

(EDIT - Didnt see your post on time Steven)... The reaction to that thread surprised me though at the time. I thought he was suggesting that if you have an issue with a vendor kit that you give the vendor a chance before airing the dirty laundry for all to see.
However with hindsight and the use of BBQ in the subject it was probably derogatory.

Even if some of BBQ's products have issues, the offending party was taking every chance to slam BBQ and made a lot of unsubstantiated claims. There's more there than just not liking BBQ's products. He was being pretty low class. Those posts should have been removed before it came to this.

That's not to say BBQ responded like an adult either. I think that removing offending posts should have been enough. He's not doing himself any favors.

Unfortunately, this whole thing is going to drive new people making a BBQ kit (they won't know of any of this) crazy. They'll post and it will disappear. 18 watt will get a lot of bad fealings from this. And it won't help BBQ either.

Just a very sad thing.

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Richard Johnson
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Playing an insturment doesn't make you a musician, listening does

BBQ was wrong for what he did.....Ironman was wrong...
However, the actions taken by BBQ were not substantiated enough...

Is an Ironman smackdown long overdue? You betcha! Given that he's selling a product, he needs to grow a little tact. He's been ripping more than just BBQ...and it's growing on peeps nerves.

Regardless, BBQ's excessive and misdirected actions into this is the most shameful act of all. The lasting effects from this particular thing, I think, will be very long reaching indeed. As the free nature of 18watt will be no more...and people wont be so free to post their thoughts on a subject, for fear of either a lawsuit or a moderator squashing it.

BBQ overrected, plain and simple...and I hope other 18watters will join me in boycotting his business...

I'll buy all the BBQ I can eat, thanks.

Lillie Langtry has been a complete and total bitch for far too long. If Lillie can't behave, he should be sent on his way. I understand he's made valued contributions, but I'm not the one getting bitched out at every opportunity, and even I'm sick of it. If I had standing, I might threaten suit to shut him the hell up.

And as for 18watt being an innocent party, bunk. They yank user privileges all the time. They could have issued warnings. But they sat on the sidelines and let one vendor drop a sh*t storm on another. I'm not saying it's all justified, but they left themselves open.

I'll be nice and give a pointer to 18watt's legal team, though. Look at Zeran v. American Online (4th Circuit, 1997), and the portion of the Communications Decency Act which it cites. I believe the law is still on their side, but if they had an ounce of sense, they wouldn't have any possible need for lawyers.

Bear
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It's flat out wrong to blame 18watt for this issue...BBQ's actions weren't justified...buying BBQ's products will only egg him on to do it again...congratulations!

Does Ironman need either a smackdown or his walking papers? yeah, I think so....but one action doesn't justify another...

But is'nt that based on hear say so far? May be we are going too fast!

I never had any use for old BBQ boy's stuff in the past, and this situation certainly doesn't endear me to him now.

I'm with Bits...boycot!...boycot!

Ted has a great reputation as a stand-up guy. It comes from the hundreds of online testimonials to his products, his services, and the way he responds to customers. His speakers are a super product at a great price, and his kits and parts allow guys to get into amp building for relatively small money. His forum has been a service to many builders and buyers, and he's never stopped anyone from recommending his competitors products. That's because, unlike some of the 18watt crowd, he understands that the person who buys from his competitor today will buy from him tomorrow. When he offered an 18 watt kit, he made it clear that it was not an authentic version, and put up a link to GDS. Pretty classy, I'd say.
In this case, what was posted on the 18watt forum was so nasty that it called for action. If you read the current message at 18watt.com




the moderator is not saying anything about the issues being discussed in this thread. The problems being dealt with above come from members who post to sell products on the forum. Ted does not sell his products on the forum, so clearly, he is not the target. The problem was within the forum, not from outside.
I used to check the forum regularly for amp building info, until it started getting filled with guys pimping their own products. That's when I moved to ax84 and stayed. Good luck with your boycott - I'll be putting an order in pretty soon, and I'm sure I'll buy many more products for many years. Get a grip.

Actually I hear a lot of TW horror stories first hand (read:face to face-not over the I'net). He is not the prince everyone makes him out to be. The one product I purchased from him I feel to be sub-standard.

The reason you don't hear about it is because of tactics like this!

Maybe, because we're all adults and they expect us to act like it instead of a couple of kids fighting in a sandbox. Most of the time no moderating is necessary at 18watt aside from moving threads into the correct forums and granting the occasional request. Both vendors should've used more tact.

Bits, you're probably right that it's not justified. What would you have done if you were in BBQ's shoes? Do we know that other measures weren't exhausted first?

BBQ is pretty straight up about what his products are and what they aren't. Lifting 18watt work product is new to me, and it clarifies some of the bad blood. I really don't see his actions in this instance as indefensible, though - the guy is trying to protect the good name of his business. He's gone to extremes to do that before as with a well known incident of an important vendor of his going AWOL. I'm sure there are bad user experiences - happens with every business, and the guy does a lot of business with the DIY community.

If it had just been retelling of bad experiences with a product, the current course would be indefensible. This, however, is about an unending vendetta that has a life beyond legitimate grievances. So what would you do if you were BBQ?

Bear

But sometimes moderating is necessary. One vendor was perpetually without tact. This was blatant and obvious. They've kicked people out for treating it like a sandbox before. If the vendor didn't contribute as much as he has, he probably would have been banned long ago without a tear shed. The mods were faced with a problem and it looks like they decided not to deal with it. I wouldn't blame them for the whole of the fiasco, but they probably could have headed it off.

Bear

Not use copper caps?

If it were me, and I had the info to back it up, I'd comment and keep it civil, if that isn't possible and it bothered me that much, I would try to take it offline and speak/email the offender directly. One thing is that, unless he's living in a vacuum, he's seen many folks having issues with his parts and kits. So, don't you think you'd pick up on it and try to improve your product? Oh but that mean jacking the price up a little on the kits. What would you rather be known for...a good kit or delivering cheap, sub-standard products?


Agreed.

OK...I don't need to pour gas on the fire.

To be clear, I have no need to boycott. I've never been a customer, and didn't plan to...

I'm not here to make any enemies either.

Apologies to any I offended...I'll just put my nose back to the grindstone and keep doing my part to maintain our beloved politically correct constructs.

Before we go to much further down this path, perhaps we need to know all the facts and then make a judgement. There is always two sides to the story. We haven't heard them yet and may never. From what rumor I hear, both sides are at fault in this one.

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Stephen
Web: www.trinityamps.com. Facebook: facebook.com/trinityamps. Twitter: @trinityamps

I agree Steve. The story I heard was someone posted a clip of Smoke on the Water and Richie Blackmore threatened to sue