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I'm not good at schematics yet, getting better by going through the docs.

It's not making a lot of sense to me how the schematic and the layouts relate to each other. The schematic sometimes appears to go "random" on the board. I know that there's a reason, just don't know what it is.

Is there any place or method to teach me how to change a schematic into a well done layout for building?

Reason I'm asking is I'm looking at old Gibson and Magnatone schematics to see what they do and at least all of the Magnotones are true point to point. I'm much better at layout! (Mechanical engineer, I like blueprints that look like the parts!!)

That's the problem with building amps, it's addicting! And cuts into the practice time so I don't suck so bad.

Thanks

Hey all,

I'd like to know this to.

I'm starting a new thread That I need Coco to change a layout for me. But how do you make those nice layouts?
Thanks,
Jac

Well, I know there is a freeware program for the actual graphic side of the layout. Visio is what I believe it's called. I'd like to know how to do the laying out side of layouts.

Actually, Stephen, a tutorial on creating layouts that goes from a simple three or four item circuit to something more moderate, could be a great way to build even more Trinity interest among the building community.

It sounds counter-intuitive, but the idea is that you reward someone BEFORE they give you their attention. A restaurant giving customers their first meal for free. Customer is likely to come back again and at least tell a few others.

I've been reading Seth Godin's marketing book, Small is the New Big. Very progressive, on-point material.

Well, sounds interesting.

I do use Visio but it's sure not Free! It's a Microsoft product which explains it all. I have tried others but always come back to this one.

The nice thing about that program is that when you connect the parts, you glue them to the connection points, then when you move them around, the joints stay connected - well that's the theory anyway.

Turret boards were an early attempt at making electronic circuits that were relatively rugged, producible, and serviceable in the days before printed wiring boards. As this method was somewhat more expensive than conventional point to point techniques it was generally found in the more expensive applications such professional, commercial, and military equipment.

Turret boards consist of a thin (generally 1/8th inch) piece of non-conductive material drilled in pattern to match the electronic layout of a set of components. Each hole drilled will have a turret positioned in it. Components are suspended between these turrets and soldered to them to create a complete circuit board.

Most of the military electronics used in WWII used this technique. Using turrets and turret boards dramatically improves reliability and serviceability.

Turret boards allowed some degree of "engineered" construction. That is, an engineer could design a loaded turret board with wire listed interconnects that could be assembled by someone skilled only in component recognition and soldering. A schematic was never needed for assembly.

An advantage of this is that components can be soldered and desoldered from the turrets indefinitely aka tweaking!

So, how do I do a layout? This may not be in perfect sequence so beware.

Summary
======
1. Start with Schematic
2. Size chassis based on tubes, controls & transformers.
3. Size board
4. Lay down parts on board (input to output)
5. Connect components to off-board parts – realign parts as necessary.
6. Connect controls
7. Connect power supply.

I start with a schematic of course and look at the parts required for each tube. The board is logical and follows the input through to the output.

The power supply parts go at the opposite end from the pre-amp. Inputs as far away from the power side as possible and the controls usually located in logical sequence according to the schematic. I also place the electrolytic caps so the ground always face one way, usually towards the front of the amp.
Mechanically, you need space for the knobs to turn and the jacks to be inserted.

I lay out the controls and tube positions according to the above logic and put the Power Tranny (PT) at the opposite end and plan to put the Output Transformer (OT) in close proximity to the output tubes and at 90 degrees to the PT to reduce induced hum.

I figure I will be placing the grid stopper resistors, input jack resistors, some tube resistors off the board.

The chassis plays an important role in the design as well due to size limitations. I space out the controls 1-1/2" or 1-3/8 apart. that will determine the minimum size along with the transformers. The tubes go in at t 1-1/2â€

_________________
Stephen
Web: www.trinityamps.com. Facebook: facebook.com/trinityamps. Twitter: @trinityamps

Thanks Stephen!

I've sat down and traced and labeled the components from the schematic to the layout on copies of the SIIIv6 to try to get a feel for what was going on and wound up getting confused, which is why I started this thread.

It's late now, but I think where I was getting most confused from the layout going "random" is where you align the electrolitics so the ground is always facing the same way. I'll have to look at that again. Makes a lot of sense and I have a feeling that I completely missed what you were doing. I also have to look again to see why sections tend to cross each other at certain places. Don't know how to better explain it now, but I'll revisit what I was doing and ask specific questions when I get a chance.

What I need to do is get some other schematics and layout s of the same circuits to compare them. I'm starting to recognize certain areas (i.e. the long tailed pair PI) but need practice. I think that I should be able to see "building blocks", i.e. tone stacks should be somewhat similar depending on company so the switch from schematic to layout should be very similar once I get to recognize what they are.

Thanks for the insight, time to do my homework on this.

Try to layout a Champ. Easy place to start.

_________________
Stephen
Web: www.trinityamps.com. Facebook: facebook.com/trinityamps. Twitter: @trinityamps

Thanks, stephen

I have visio, so I try this out.
Jac

Is it possible to get a couple of templates to help start?
If not, that's okay.
Thanks, Jac

Sure, I can zip them and send some off to you to play with. Hope you're good with Visio..

_________________
Stephen
Web: www.trinityamps.com. Facebook: facebook.com/trinityamps. Twitter: @trinityamps

Not at all. but have to learn

So we'll see.

Thankyou,
Jac

steal the thread

Hows the TC going. very excited
Jac

Well I color coded the sections between the schematic and the layout, inputs, tone stack normal channel, tone stack TMB, Master Volume section, PI section, power tube section. (I am such an engineer sometimes, nerdy!)

Now I can see how things progress across the board and how the tube stages work. I just got how the signal goes to the screens and the output from the plate goes to the screen of the next stage. Never popped out to me before

Have to do more studying! The wiring of V2 is confusing me a bit now, but things are getting better.

any update on the zip files Coco, just curious, I know your busy.

Thanks, just want to play and learn.
Jac

Right Click on this link to download a Zipped Visio file of some useful parts:


http://www.trinityamps.com/ForumGallery ... yParts.zip

_________________
Stephen
Web: www.trinityamps.com. Facebook: facebook.com/trinityamps. Twitter: @trinityamps

Thanks, Stephen. See what kind of trouble I can get into know

Stephen,

Where do you get the part images from?

Thanks.
Kenny

I drew some, borrowed some, modified some. i.e. wherever I could find & collect them!

_________________
Stephen
Web: www.trinityamps.com. Facebook: facebook.com/trinityamps. Twitter: @trinityamps

http://www.trinityamps.com/ForumGallery ... yParts.zip

Stephen,

Is it possible to save and send a copy of this file as an XML Drawing? I think that is an option in Visio. That will allow folks like me that use a Mac to open the file in Omni Graffle.

Thanks for all your help!
dgately

Download this & try it:


http://www.trinityamps.com/ForumGallery ... yParts.vdx

_________________
Stephen
Web: www.trinityamps.com. Facebook: facebook.com/trinityamps. Twitter: @trinityamps